172 | Keeping Choir Fun, Inclusive, and Inspiring with Debbie O'Shea - HD 720p
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[00:00:00] You're listening to That Music Podcast with Bryson Tarbin, the curriculum designer and educational consultant behind That Music Teacher and the Elementary Music Summit. Each week, Bryson and his guests will dive into the reality of being an elementary music teacher and how music can truly be transformative in the lives of the students you serve.
[00:00:23] Show notes and resources mentioned in this episode can be found at thatmusicteacher. com.
[00:00:35] Bryson Tarbet: Hello everyone. And welcome back to that music podcast. I am super excited to welcome Debbie O'Shea to the podcast. We are going to be talking all things choir and keeping it fun. And Debbie, I'm just so excited to talk with you. I, it's always a blast.
[00:00:50] Debbie O'Shea: Thank you so much, Bryson. Thanks for the invitation.
[00:00:53] Debbie O'Shea: Any opportunity I can get to speak about the power of singing in a group, I'm going to take it.
[00:00:59] Bryson Tarbet: Well, I can't wait [00:01:00] to see what we can dive into. So to get us started, can you let us know what inspired you, um, just to be a music teacher in general, I guess, but also to really, um, from what I've experienced with you at the, you know, our various summits is you really do have that passion in that choral music.
[00:01:16] Bryson Tarbet: So what do you love about Working with choirs, what got you here and just kind of give everyone a little bit of a, a Debbie in a, in a short little, much shorter answer than the question that I'm giving you.
[00:01:32] Debbie O'Shea: Look in a nutshell, uh, I love to sing. And I believe in the power of music, uh, and being in education. And I started as a general classroom teacher. And after a couple of years, I went, I want to do this music thing all the time. And partly because I think that we can give the children the joy. We can give the children that [00:02:00] sense of belonging, um, the sense of community, the sense of unity.
[00:02:06] Debbie O'Shea: And I feel that when I sing in a group and I can see it with the children and I don't mean to be a bit, a negative Nancy, but things in schools tend to be going a little bit, um, assessment focused, testing, uh, progress, sit in desks, play based learning is starting to be lost in early childhood, and I think We can give the children that in our music classrooms and in our choir rooms.
[00:02:39] Debbie O'Shea: So I think it's about, for me, it's about joy and it's about singing together at the same time, growing our brains.
[00:02:48] Bryson Tarbet: Real quick, I want to kind of ask you a question that I didn't actually ask you in our pre interview. Um, but I think it's a question that's kind of worth talking about, which is, do you think there's [00:03:00] a difference, especially at, you know, the primary level of, you know, of a music classroom and a choir classroom?
[00:03:06] Bryson Tarbet: And if so, what would that be? And should there be a difference?
[00:03:12] Debbie O'Shea: That is a really good question, because I think often there's a huge difference. And I don't think there should be. That's, that's the nutshell answer. I really think that the choir rehearsal room should be just like the music room. And you know, as we get to go through a few of the other things we said we'd talk about, I think that most choir rehearsals would be improved by applying some of the principles that we apply in the music classroom.
[00:03:45] Bryson Tarbet: I cannot agree more. I only did one, one year of choir. I had one semester or one section of choir my, my last year in the classroom. And I struggled a lot with it at the beginning because I came at it from this [00:04:00] like, This is choir coming at it kind of from the secondary lens rather than coming it from, you know, my expertise Which is the elementary world and once I made the switch to we're just doing this a little different way But we're still coming at it from this kind of like common language I saw a lot of the things that I think we're going to get into today especially when it comes to just The joy, kind of like what you were talking about.
[00:04:24] Bryson Tarbet: So, I would love to get started with our conversation about, um, community, because I think that's a really cool thing that, that brings a lot of us teachers into this world, is the community of a type, this kind of ensemble. So, how do you create a sense of belonging and teamwork in your choir classrooms?
[00:04:43] Debbie O'Shea: This is a fairly long answer. I will try to, I'll try to be brief. Um, people who know me know I don't do brief very well, but I'm going to try. Okay, um, fun and enjoyment. Now, um, I've spoken to some people who don't like to use the [00:05:00] word fun because it makes it sound like we're being frivolous. I don't mean frivolous.
[00:05:05] Debbie O'Shea: You can have fun and enjoy things, but still achieve. And I think that I have seen a few too many serious rehearsals. Um, yes, the music's important. Oh, it's so wonderful if we can get things sounding just right. But you know, it's nowhere near as important as what we're doing for the children. Uh, I think we have to keep focused on that.
[00:05:32] Debbie O'Shea: So you keep it fun, you keep it enjoyable. I think the use of warmups is vital. Um, And it's easy to skip. I'm guilty of that myself. Oh, we don't know that alto part properly and the performance is in three weeks. What are we going to do? I better skip the warm up. Well planned warm ups act as icebreakers and team builders.
[00:05:58] Debbie O'Shea: Um, and it helps the [00:06:00] kids to leave their baggage, I'll do air quotes, leave their baggage at the door. Um, and help. everyone feel like the choir. Uh, we need shared vision and values. Now that sounds very grown up, doesn't it? But kids actually can do that. They can embody respect, commitment, support. If you expect that, they will give it to you.
[00:06:27] Debbie O'Shea: In fact, it's your job to teach them because they might not learn that in other places. And if they have that shared vision and values, with the group, then they enter the choir room and that is part of their community. I think it's important we, as conductors, use inclusive language and inclusive practices.
[00:06:49] Debbie O'Shea: I'll give you a little personal story. I worked at a boys school for several years, you know, when the dinosaurs roamed the earth in the 80s. Uh, [00:07:00] and I started using when I was working there, I used the term guys. Just come on guys over here. You know like now you might say peeps or whatever. And then I carried that in as just a habit.
[00:07:13] Debbie O'Shea: And I did not mean people who identified as males. It was just like guys, humanity. You know? So I didn't mean it. in any sexist sense, but I guess it was stemmed from, um, a sexist sort of origin. And I just thought, look, no one's ever been offended by this, but I might just stop because I could be offending people.
[00:07:43] Debbie O'Shea: You know, you've just got to be careful. So, and it's a habit. I mean, Hey guys, how are you going? So I stopped using guys. I know that's only a small illustration, but I think it's important that we reflect on what we do and what we [00:08:00] say at all times. So you make sure that you're inclusive. Uh, I think we need to celebrate success milestones, especially younger choirs might even just sing happy birthday to the birthdays that week.
[00:08:13] Debbie O'Shea: Um, something that. Celebrates them, I think, building some leadership roles. However, all of the older students in the group act as leaders. I think it's important to build that in. Uh, and I think the conductor, there's lots of I thinks in here, because obviously this is, you know, everyone's got to do themselves.
[00:08:37] Debbie O'Shea: You know, you do you. Um, but I think the conductor needs to be approachable. I think that children need to feel free to come and talk to you. And say, um, Oh, I'm sorry, you know, Mary was poking me in the back. Could you keep an eye on that for next week? Or, I heard this really good song on the radio. I, I just [00:09:00] think we need to be approachable and to listen.
[00:09:03] Debbie O'Shea: And if we do all of those things, um, we've got a positive choir
[00:09:08] Bryson Tarbet: community. I, I think that was a very multifaceted answer. Um, and I would expect nothing else from you Debbie, but I think it was also a wonderful one. And I think that there's a lot of things that we can pull out of that. Excuse me. The first one that really resonated with me is, you know, I am a CIS man, but my voice changed very late.
[00:09:28] Bryson Tarbet: So I spent a lot, a lot of time. In the Alto section being referred to, all right, come on, ladies and like, it really wasn't that huge of an issue, but like, it did bother me, you know, and I think that's one of those things where, again, it wasn't intentional and it wasn't being done, you know, there weren't making eye contact with me as they said, it was just kind of like you said, a habit.
[00:09:50] Bryson Tarbet: I think that's That right there is just something that we can just be aware of the habits that we have in our teaching. And then I also really want to, really want to bring [00:10:00] attention to the idea of being approachable. I mean, I think we've, let's be honest as musicians, we have all had very We've had different conductors and we've had some that have made us feel wonderful and then we have had some that have made us feel really bad.
[00:10:15] Bryson Tarbet: Um, and I think it's really important that to recognize that like we can still get a good product without being the scary conductor on the podium that like is, you know, makes people afraid to make mistakes. And, and I think that that approachable and just the human side of it being able to be like, hey.
[00:10:34] Bryson Tarbet: Just, just being you, and like, I love how you also said, you know, you do you, and I think that's a really cool thing that we can talk about a little bit more. Alright, Debbie, so what are some ways that you would suggest on how you can keep students engaged, motivated, especially when Maybe you have like a particular challenging piece of music that it's like kind of a struggle and like it's like pulling hair out.
[00:10:58] Bryson Tarbet: How do you keep the fun [00:11:00] and the excitement there?
[00:11:02] Debbie O'Shea: Oh, yeah, that's a tricky one. Um, I think the first thing is that be careful with your repertoire selection. Uh, but sometimes Yeah, sometimes you do have to do things that aren't quite, you might be going in a festival and everybody is doing this particular piece of music.
[00:11:23] Debbie O'Shea: So, but I think step one is look at your repertoire. Uh, and I, I guess I like the KISS principle. Like you keep it simple, stupid, you know, you do like, I would rather hear something simple. sung beautifully than a choir falling over itself in these difficult passages. And, like, I'm not impressed by that, because why would you do that to these poor choristers?
[00:11:50] Debbie O'Shea: It's obviously above them. So, repertoire selection. Keep it simple. Uh, I like, and I learnt quite a few of these techniques [00:12:00] from the beautiful Catherine, really. I'll be referring to him, to her during these. episode because she conducts the choirs at the school I was, have been at for eight years. Beautiful conductor and composer.
[00:12:14] Debbie O'Shea: Uh, she asks the children how the sounds could be improved. So they're working on something and you say to the children, could that be better? What could we do? It is stunning what the children come up with. They come up with things that I wouldn't have thought of. Um, on a completely different tangent. It, they might come up with something about dynamics and you're worried about a flat note or, you know, there's, I think we underestimate children.
[00:12:47] Debbie O'Shea: So I think that, um, let's ask them how it could be improved. Another one, but I think you've got to have that relationship with the kids before these suggestions work. [00:13:00] Uh, ask them how you could show it better. So they're not getting things correct. So, say to them, now, altos here, that we're just not getting the support on that note, or that long note is going flat, we need more air, how could I show you better as a conductor?
[00:13:22] Debbie O'Shea: And they give you suggestions and you try it out. And ask them which one worked for you, then you take on that gesture. You know, I think you do need a fair bit of conducting knowledge. You do need to know how to beat your patterns. And you do need to know how to show some basic expressive things. But ask the children.
[00:13:44] Debbie O'Shea: I think we underestimate them a lot. Another little thing that I do I'm going to stop you right
[00:13:50] Bryson Tarbet: there real quick. Yes, sure. Because I, it's, it's funny How many conversations I have that focus right and right what you just said, which is we often [00:14:00] are underestimating our students. This is a huge common thread and I cannot agree more.
[00:14:05] Bryson Tarbet: Um, but I will let you finish your answer. I just needed to interject.
[00:14:09] Debbie O'Shea: But it's true, isn't it? You let give them, it's empowering them to, and then they think, Oh, I've got something that I can contribute. That's, that's our job as an educator, isn't it? Anyway, um, uh, just a couple more things. I just think you should always have.
[00:14:28] Debbie O'Shea: Uh, a fun slash silly slash movement type song up your sleeve ready to go and this is I think an important skill for you as a conductor, um, slash teacher when things are getting too intense or you can see that. Oh, the eyes glaze over thinking I'm getting nowhere here. Uh, you may as well just do something a little bit fun.
[00:14:58] Debbie O'Shea: It's still musical. It's [00:15:00] still engaging. Things like lean forwards, lean backwards and do the actions. And most people know that one, you know, um, sorry, I am battling a sore throat, but like the lean forwards, lean backwards to the left, to the right, etc. Um, when they know it really well. Do the actions, but do the opposite action to what the text says.
[00:15:22] Debbie O'Shea: That's always challenging. So, something like that. Pull that one up. Um, I'm alive, awake, alert, enthusiastic is a cute little one. My bonnie lies over the ocean. Every time there is a word starting with B, they stand or they sit. And they're popping up and down. And that's lots of fun. So, have a couple of them up your sleeve that the kids will love.
[00:15:47] Debbie O'Shea: They move. It's just human like I know after we've recorded this podcast and I've sat here and I'm excited and everything, but I'm going to need to get up and move around after this. [00:16:00] So I just think don't forget they're little humans and they need to do that. So have something up your sleeve for when things are getting too hard because there's no point.
[00:16:11] Debbie O'Shea: Um. You know, what you can lead, lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink, you know, don't keep stabbing at something that's not working, just stop, do something else.
[00:16:23] Bryson Tarbet: So many wonderful points. I, I have a few things that I wanted, I have a few things that I'd love to zoom in on because I think they're really important.
[00:16:31] Bryson Tarbet: First of all, the repertoire is so important. Don't get me wrong. I love hearing these wonderful children's choruses that have these, you know, multi parts and everything going on. But. But the reality is, is there are certain things that you can do and can't do within your constraints. And we as teachers need to understand that we need to set our students up for success.
[00:16:55] Bryson Tarbet: Um, I, I just, I, I think that's the same thing with chorus. I think it's when we do it [00:17:00] with recorder, you know, don't give a kid that just got a recorder set, you know, seven different notes. It's not going to work. Like that's a huge thing that I think we, we get wrong as teachers sometimes. Um, But the biggest thing that I want to talk about, and I want to zoom in a little bit, is how you mentioned, if you can't figure out what's going on, if you can't, you know, you're trying to get the altos to sing whatever part, ask them what you can do.
[00:17:25] Bryson Tarbet: And I think that is a huge thing in, in so many different aspects of teaching. That's showing humility, that's showing willingness to just want to help. And that, That is a huge thing that I've noticed, especially when it comes to like behaviors are like, hey, you know What can I do to help you stay on track or whatever?
[00:17:44] Bryson Tarbet: Like that's really helpful but in this case I think it really it's a really good way to To flip the switch a little bit or flip the script and instead of the the you know The singer is thinking alright, you know We got to do this. We got to do this. We got to do this. It, it turns in a way with, we need to respond to that [00:18:00] and then we have to take a step back and we have to figure out what do we need in order to respond to it.
[00:18:04] Bryson Tarbet: And I think that is a, a really good tidbit to take away from the episode. Alrighty. So I want to talk a little bit. Uh, we've kind of talked a little bit about this already, but, um, To make rehearsals, um, because just like a lot of us have worked in with conductors that we really enjoyed and some that we really didn't like, we've also had those rehearsals that were an absolute blast.
[00:18:27] Bryson Tarbet: And then the ones that we're just like, why do I do this again? So how do we balance, you know, doing things fun and doing, you know, things that are engaging, kind of like we talked about in, you know, in the last question. And then also understanding that we have things to do. We have, we have to get through the process of teaching this music and then refining it.
[00:18:48] Bryson Tarbet: So how do we, how do we find that balance? And what does that, what does that look like in an ideal situation in your, your view at least?
[00:18:59] Debbie O'Shea: I, [00:19:00] I know that people might not necessarily like this answer, but I actually think that a lot of it comes down to planning. Um, you actually need to plan your rehearsals.
[00:19:12] Debbie O'Shea: Um, and I know it's such a, especially if you're in a position like I've always been in where choir is just the. added bit. You know, my core work is in the classroom. Uh, and then choir is the add on, which we don't have to do. Uh, I've been in schools where it's not even counted as like, say, a duty, a playground duty, or it's just literally what you give on top of your job.
[00:19:40] Debbie O'Shea: So you don't have a lot of time. to do that planning because it's not your core business. But I think it's really important that you have a plan, even if there's a templated type plan that you follow. Uh, I think you keep notes [00:20:00] of things as you go through your rehearsal, use sticky notes, uh, Claire. has taught me about having sticky notes and you just write on, oh, we didn't quite get that, put the sticky note on.
[00:20:13] Debbie O'Shea: Um, and you keep chipping away. Give yourself as big a lead time as you can to prepare things. So you've got variety. You've got, it's, it's Do you know what? It's just like running a good lesson. Just to bring it back to the theme from the beginning. You don't go, today I am teaching this difficult four part piece.
[00:20:35] Debbie O'Shea: I'm doing this for 45 minutes, end of story. Nobody's going to do that. That is boring. Right? But you do things like in your warm up you might have a little aspect in that warm up of something difficult in the song coming up so that you're helping them to learn those little motifs and then you might do, um, [00:21:00] a little bit of focused work, then a bit more relaxed work.
[00:21:04] Debbie O'Shea: Don't always start at the beginning of the piece. Say we're going to just work on this little piece here. Um, I'd like to mention Binnet. I'm sort of jumping all over my notes here. So Binnet was, if you want, episode 73 of the Crescendo podcast. It was a solo one. Um, where I got this idea from lovely Catherine Reilly.
[00:21:30] Debbie O'Shea: And you write just on a scrap piece of paper. each of the things you're planning to do in that lesson. There might be 20 things. It might just be work on the alto part of this piece, bars 10 to 15, until we have it from memory. And then you pull out the sheet. You work on it. When it's done, one of you invite one of the children up and they rip it up or stomp on it [00:22:00] and bin it because it's done and they go through it.
[00:22:03] Debbie O'Shea: It works. It's magic. Don't do it every lesson. That would be boring. That's something you have just up your sleeve. Um, so that is, uh, a very clear example of planning your rehearsal. But the kids are also involved and they're saying, right, we've done that bit now, let's do this bit. Um, I think that's important to plan and reflect and have moments of focus, moments of relaxation.
[00:22:32] Debbie O'Shea: Don't spend too long on one thing. Don't let the time limits and the time frames, that's what, if I look back at my history of working with choir, if anything has killed bits of my rehearsal, it's that. be ready for that competition or be ready for that performance. And you know what, having my time again, I wouldn't push that hard.
[00:22:58] Debbie O'Shea: If I had to, I'd [00:23:00] enter the estedford with the second verse or say the verses unison instead of two part and I'd write a note to the adjudicator. Um, we're singing the chorus in two parts as written. Um, we've only learnt the verses in unison. There we go. They can mark us down, or they could say, Oh, they were realistic and they're meant to do this.
[00:23:28] Debbie O'Shea: It depends on your adjudicator. Uh, don't, it's not worth it. It's not worth it. Just make a note and move on.
[00:23:36] Bryson Tarbet: Yeah, I mean that, that brings a really, really philosophical question, which is, you know, what is the purpose of a choir? What is, what is our job? Is our job to get to make beautiful music that gets top scores?
[00:23:52] Bryson Tarbet: Or is our job to make music that hopefully we can get to beautiful? While equipping these students with just [00:24:00] the ability to understand the music around them and to, to learn the work ethic of learning a hard piece, and there's just so much more to that. Um, so I'm kind of skipping ahead a little bit because this is such a, such a parallel question, but we will backtrack.
[00:24:15] Bryson Tarbet: Um, how do you help your students see the value of choir? Period. But then also beyond school.
[00:24:23] Debbie O'Shea: Yes. Um, and I just want to say before I go on to those ones, um, I'm actually very happily going to be a little guest in, um, in your community for the masterclass. And one of the things I'm actually going to talk about is the why, um, I think, I think it's essential that you are clear on your why for the choir.
[00:24:51] Debbie O'Shea: It's really essential. Okay, so back on your question. Just now, tell me, tell me again. Ask me again. How do
[00:24:59] Bryson Tarbet: [00:25:00] you get your students to find the value in choir? Um, especially beyond school?
[00:25:05] Debbie O'Shea: Yes, absolutely. It's so important. Um, they need to see that value beyond school, don't they? Uh, I think, one, meaningful performances.
[00:25:17] Debbie O'Shea: I mean, we are a performing art. Aren't we? I'm finding that more and more difficult. Um, for reasons that are not musical. Uh, for example, it's more complex and more difficult to get children to a performance now. The administrative load is massive. We write things, variation to school routines and risk assessments, and buses, the prices of buses have gone through the roof.
[00:25:50] Debbie O'Shea: We just basically don't go anywhere at the moment, um, because we can't afford the buses. Um, it's, we can't take them out of school [00:26:00] because they'll miss something really important like maths. Um, there's all sorts of things working against us to get children to performances, right? But meaningful performances.
[00:26:14] Debbie O'Shea: Even if it's, um, singing at Grandparents Day, when, at, with the preps and the little kids are there, or going to the aged care home, I, I, I think it's important to think about, comes back to you why again, I think it's a shame if your only choir performances are a competition to win the trophy. And I'm at a school where we win trophies.
[00:26:41] Debbie O'Shea: Choir's incredible. Um, so I'm not saying that's bad. I'm saying it's got to be balanced. So looking for meaningful performances. I also think, uh, stories that are told through music. It's about the lyrics. It's about the meaning. It's about [00:27:00] communicating with people emotionally. And that is powerful. And that will take you well beyond school, having that in your heart.
[00:27:10] Debbie O'Shea: I also think, being part of something like Together Sing, which I'm hoping people have heard of, which, um, well, Deb Brydon and I basically started a couple of years ago, and it's free, and it's Over 100, 000 singers all sing this song, which is based on the importance of singing together for well being and I think being part of something slightly larger like that can help children see that there is something past just singing in our little room.
[00:27:48] Bryson Tarbet: Yeah, I, I have to say, I, I was a part of Together Sing with, with my choir. And first of all, the kids loved the piece, uh, the year that I did it. And, but it was also really cool to see them. Make that [00:28:00] connection. You know, we were a small rural school in, in Ohio and I got to tell them like, yeah, you know, there's some music teachers, you know, in Australia that they started this thing and they're like, we're singing the Australia song today and the kids, the kids loved it.
[00:28:13] Bryson Tarbet: And they were able to make that connection. And I agree. I think whenever we were able to. Um, use music as a way to show that there's just so much more out there. Um, so we will be sure to put the link to Together Singing in the show notes wherever you're watching or listening because it is a wonderful thing that you can sign up for at any time.
[00:28:33] Bryson Tarbet: Um, and correct me if I'm wrong, there's a new piece every year?
[00:28:36] Debbie O'Shea: There is, and in fact we've just got the draft of the first piece, of the piece for 2025 and Joe Twist has been the composer this year and, oh, this will be a first, I don't think Anyone knows this? I'm actually the lyricist and I've been working with Joe on it.
[00:28:55] Debbie O'Shea: Oh, it's exciting. Um, I'm so excited. I'm sorry, I will [00:29:00] contain myself. Um, but it's, and Joe Twist is a fabulous composer and I, he's done many great things, but he is one of the composers for Bluey. Um, Geoff Bush is the main one, but, um, But Joe has done some of the music for Bluey and won some awards. He's, he's just amazing.
[00:29:23] Debbie O'Shea: Um, and has spent quite a bit of time in America as well. So, I just think if you look for opportunities to take things a little bit broader than your classroom. That helps kids to see that value of choir behind, beyond school.
[00:29:38] Bryson Tarbet: I love that. And speaking of various philosophical questions, this one might not be as deep as the last one, but how do you know when a rehearsal has been successful?
[00:29:49] Debbie O'Shea: It's actually a really important question, I think. I think smiles, um, energy, You can [00:30:00] see that, that, that these children are leaving the room in a different state. I know, doesn't that sound all woo woo? But you know, you know what I mean. Um, they also know they've progressed. You know that you've basically completed your plan or altered your plan as needed.
[00:30:21] Debbie O'Shea: You can be quite satisfied with that going. Right, that didn't work. I was flexible. That was great. I've used my time effectively. I've had joy. I've had variety. I've, things were well paced. We actually sounded better. The choir told that story. Um, here's a big one for me. And it actually usually happens at some point.
[00:30:45] Debbie O'Shea: Somewhere in the rehearsal, I got goosebumps. That's success. I always tell the kids if that happens. And it might just be literally, you know, two notes. Just there was something [00:31:00] about the delivery, the way they blended. Um, yeah, and so it's not really a very firm answer. Like I said, it's a bit of a woo woo answer, but the kids know it, and you know it.
[00:31:15] Bryson Tarbet: I mean, even just as you were answering that question, I kind of teared up a little bit because I remember those moments because I, I never thought I'd teach choir, whole, whole thing. But like, you know, walking into their classroom and, you know, having 56th graders looking at me and, what am I doing? What's this gonna go?
[00:31:32] Bryson Tarbet: And then we just, just seeing how much It changed not only their energy by the end of class, but also my energy. I, on choir days, I was always so much more ready to go on and take on the rest of the day. Um, because the energy was better, and the energy was different, and I think a big thing that, you know, The answer to that question is going to be different to a lot of people, but I [00:32:00] think it's so important, like you said, that whoever you are, you make that distinction.
[00:32:06] Bryson Tarbet: What is successful? How would you, how do you, how are you going to qualify it as a success or not? Cause I don't think if you have that answer, you know where to direct things. So you are going to, first of all, if you've never seen Debbie present, she's amazing and she always has, 10 times more information than she has the time to share and it's amazing.
[00:32:28] Bryson Tarbet: Um, she's just a treasure chest of knowledge, uh, but you are going to be giving a masterclass inside that music teacher community, which is our membership for professional development. Uh, so without giving too much away, can you let our listeners know what they should look forward to in that masterclass?
[00:32:45] Debbie O'Shea: It was very tricky because you know, you've given me an area this big. Um, but. I've narrowed it down, uh, and I, I want something that will help. [00:33:00] Inspire help teachers to inspire and engage their choirs. So it's gotta be practical. Um, and I've narrowed, I've just narrowed it down to three things, and they all start with w Um, so it's called a ww w.choir.org, or you.au.
[00:33:19] Debbie O'Shea: It's not an actual, it's not an actual website. Do not go to www dot choir au. But see, I needed the AU because it's Australia. So, I'm going to talk about the whys. Um, and do you know what? If we just have a quick reflection on the things you and I have spoken about, Bryson, so much of it comes down to our why.
[00:33:43] Debbie O'Shea: Why are you doing it in the first place? Um, so I want to really delve into the why. I want to talk warm ups because I think they can be really valuable. And I also want to talk about what to [00:34:00] sing because that either sets you up for failure or success.
[00:34:04] Bryson Tarbet: That is great. I, I can't wait. Uh, and I think it's one of those things where I, I, I kind of hate the phrase, phrase, remember your why, because it has been so weaponized.
[00:34:14] Bryson Tarbet: But the reality is, is that if we don't have the why, we can't make decisions to get us closer to that or to keep us closer to that. And I think, I think that is kind of what you're saying is, is what, what is the purpose? What do you, what do you want to come out of this? How do we, how do you want to be How do you want this to be?
[00:34:36] Bryson Tarbet: And I think that is, is something that I think. Um, even in, you know, when I only gave you an hour to fit that huge topic in, um, I think it's important to mention because it is so foundational. If you are not a current member of that music teacher community, we will put the link in the show notes here. You can join, um, and catch Debbie's masterclass.
[00:34:55] Bryson Tarbet: If you are listening in the future, that masterclass is now part of our professional development [00:35:00] library inside of the community. Uh, so you can still watch it. Uh, Debbie, thank you so much for chatting with us today. Before we say goodbye, will you let our listeners know where they can learn more about you and connect with you online?
[00:35:11] Debbie O'Shea: I'm in most of the socials, but crescendo. com. au is my website. And you can just sign up for my newsletters on I hang out on Facebook mainly. That's because my sons tell me that I'm old. Um I find that a bit offensive. Um but yeah, Crescendo dot com dot AU and you can see all of the things that I do there and I'd love people to um listen to my podcast as well.
[00:35:42] Debbie O'Shea: The Crescendo Music Education podcast. I have fabulous guests. Don't I Bryson?
[00:35:48] Bryson Tarbet: Yeah, you sure do. I'll let you in on a secret. We're literally gonna record an episode with me on her podcast the moment we're done with this one. So little secret there. [00:36:00] All right, and we'll be sure to put the link in that as well.
[00:36:04] Bryson Tarbet: Debbie, thank you so much for sharing your expertise with us. And if you are listening, thank you so much again for joining us for an episode of That Music Podcast. If you have not left us a review, it would mean the world to to us if you would leave us a review wherever you're listening. And as always, in case nobody has told you lately, thank you so, so much for making a difference in the lives of the students that you teach.
